one of the principal parties through an effort to get some splinter party in to cut down the vote of the other party. Regardless of how it came, the addition of splinter parties, of third parties, is deliberately encouraged in my opinion by such a program as the President's suggestion in the event there is no candidate in the first election which gets 40 percent of the total electoral weight.

I should add again, when I said earlier in my statement that such an election would add very greatly to the expense of elections, which are already too great in the opinion of most citizens, and are largely responsible, in my opinion, for the disfavor in which politics now exists in the minds of too many people, and would also bring about a great delay.

If that delay came up into December, it would bring about a throwing of the election in confused weather conditions, which would be sure to downgrade the weight of certain of the States. This would not happen to be in my part of the Nation, but nevertheless certain States would find themselves downgraded, if there were a popular election of Presidents in that second election as suggested by President Nixon.

I agree, therefore, with all of the earlier portion of his suggestions. I greatly approve the fractional division of the electoral weight of each State as the preferable course to follow.

Second, I would prefer the so-called District Plan, which is certainly much better than either the present program or than the popular election of Presidents. But I cannot approve the Presidents going to the popular election plan in the event a second election is called, and I much prefer what is provided in my own amendment, which would throw the matter then into the entire Congress, the House plus the Senate, with every Congressman and every Senator having a full vote in the election of the President between the two candidates who had the highest vote in the electoral weight count in the first election.

That would come as near to preserving the republican system which we have, the federal system under which we have lived, since the Constitution was adopted, as anything else, because it would still give two votes to each State, based on their statehood, based now on two Senators, and would give the vote to each district in the State based on the population of that State.

Under my proposal, S.J. Res. 4, in the event no candidate for the office of President and Vice President receives 40 percent of the electoral vote, Members of the House of Representatives and Senate, sitting in joint session shall choose, immediately by ballot, the President and Vice President-the majority of the votes of the combined membership of the House of Representatives and Senate being necessary for a choice. As you can see, should my resolution be adopted, each State will retain its full weight by population and its weight as a sovereign State unit of government as it now has under the present system, and as envisioned by our Founding Fathers in order to protect remote and underdeveloped smaller States from perpetual stepchild

status.

My proposal would not be an open invitation for the formation of splinter or third party efforts.

Former President Johnson voted in 1956 in favor of the Daniel comprise amendment which permitted States the choice between the

proportional and district plan of reform. Former Presidents of the United States, Truman and Eisenhower, have communicated with this committee and expressed agreement that change should be made in the method of selecting our President and Vice President.

Mr. Chairman, there will never be a better time than the present to completely overhaul the ancient and outworn machinery now provided for the election of the President and Vice President. There is and should be an absolute bipartisan effort. And in my judgment, no plan has yet been advanced which preserves and safeguards our federal system, that better achieves the result of fair and democratic reform of the electoral system than does the proportional plan which I now propose. I urge its acceptance by both this subcommittee and the full Judiciary Committee. I also request that the complete text of my resolution be printed in the record of the hearings at this point. I thank you, Mr. Chairman, and in closing may I just say this, and I am not saying this in disrespect to anyone, because I think that there is plenty of room for good conscientious differences in this matter, but as one who has been engaged in practical politics for a long time, during which I have also tried to remain in the constitutional field, it seems to me that it would be completely futile to suggest to the States the election of President and Vice President by popular vote.

I cannot see the 32 States, which are deprived of a part and some of them of a great part of their weight in the election of the President and Vice President supporting that particular amendment.

Certainly I think there would be well more than 12 of them, because more than 12 are hurt very seriously, are hurt in a major way, are cut down by a major percentage in their importance in the selection of President and Vice President by the popular election system, and I just do not believe that practical thinking can bring the conclusion that there is a chance for the adoption of the constitutional amendment requiring election of President and Vice President by popular vote by the legislatures of 39 States as required.

Mr. Chairman, I thank you very much for your indulgence and courtesy.

(The resolution Senator Holland referred to follows, together with the tabulation consisting of three pages to be included in the record at this point:)

JOINT RESOLUTION Proposing an amendment to the Constitution of the United States relating to the election of the President and Vice President

Resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled (two-thirds of each House concurring therein), That the following article is proposed as an amendment to the Constitution of the United States, which shall be valid to all intents and purposes as part of the Constitution when ratified by the legislatures of three-fourths of the several States:

"SECTION 1. The executive power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America. He shall hold his office during a term of four years, and together with the Vice President, chosen for the same term, be elected as provided in this Constitution. No person constitutionally ineligible for the office of President shall be eligible for that of Vice President of the United States.

"Each State shall be entitled to cast for President and Vice President a number of electoral votes equal to the whole number of Senators and Representatives to which such State may be entitled in the Congress. Such electoral votes shall be cast, in the manner provided by section 3 of this article, upon the basis of an election in which the people of such State shall cast their votes for President and for Vice President. The voters in each State in any such election shall have the qualifications requisite for persons voting for members of the most numerous branch of the State legislature.

"The Congress shall determine the time of such election, which shall be the same throughout the United States. Until otherwise determined by the Congress, such election shall be held on the Tuesday next after the first Monday in November of the year preceding the year in which the regular term of the President is to begin.

"SEC. 2. In such election within any State, each voter by one ballot shall cast his vote for President, and his vote for Vice President. The name of any person may be placed upon any ballot for President or for Vice President only with the consent of such person.

"Within forty-five days after the election, or at such time as the Congress shall direct, the official custodian of the election returns of each State shall prepare, sign, certify, and transmit sealed to the seat of the Government of the United States, directed to the President of the Senate, a list of all persons for whom votes were cast for President and a separate list of all persons for whom votes were cast for Vice President. Upon each such list there shall be entered the number of votes cast for each person whose name appears thereon, and the total number of votes cast in such State for all persons whose names appear thereon.

"SEC. 3. On the 6th day of January following the election, unless the Congress by law appoints a different day not earlier than the 4th day of January and not later than the 10th day of January, the President of the Senate shall, in the presence of the Senate and House of Representatives, open all the certificates and the electoral votes shall then be counted. Each person for whom votes were cast for President in each State shall be credited with such proportion of the electoral votes thereof as he received of the total vote of the electors therein for President, and each person for whom votes were cast for Vice President in each State shall be credited with such proportion of the electoral votes thereof as he received of the total vote of the electors therein for Vice President. In making the computations, fractional numbers less than one-thousandth shall be disregarded. The person having the greatest number of electoral votes for President shall be President, if such number be at least 40 per centum of the whole number of such electoral votes. If no person has at least 40 per centum of the whole number of electoral votes, then from the persons having the three highest number of electoral votes for President, the Senate and the House of Representatives sitting in joint session shall choose immediately, by ballot, the President. A majority of the votes of the combined authorized membership of the Senate and the House of Representatives shall be necessary for a choice.

"The Vice President shall be likewise elected, at the same time and in the same manner and subject to the same provisions, as the President, but no person constitutionally ineligible for the office of President shall be eligible to that of Vice President of the United States.

"SEC. 4. If, at the time fixed for the counting of the electoral votes as provided in section 3, the presidential candidate who would have been entitled to receive a majority of the electoral votes for President has died, the vice-presidential candidate who is entitled to receive the majority of the electoral votes for Vice President shall become President-elect.

"SEC. 5. The Congress may by law provide for the case of the death of any of the persons from whom the Senate and House of Representatives may choose a President or a Vice President whenever the right of choice shall have devolved upon them, and for the case of death of both the presidential and vice-presidential candidates who, except for their death, would have been entitled to become President and Vice President.

"SEC. 6. The first, second, third, and fourth paragraphs of section 1, article II, of the Constitution, the twelfth article of amendment to the Constitution, and section 4 of the twentieth article of amendment to the Constitution, are hereby repealed.

"SEC. 7. This article shall be inoperative unless it shall have been ratified as an amendment to the Constitution by the legislatures of three-fourths of the States within seven years from the date of its submission to the States by the Congress."

Senator BAYH. Thank you very much, Senator Holland. Do you have time to go to colloquy? I see my colleague from Nebraska has been making some notes as I have. Perhaps you would like to expand on your testimony if time permits.

Senator HOLLAND. I would be happy to expand at any length that you desire me to do so. I am happy that you have that desire.

Senator BAYH. I would just like to say that my colleague knows that I do not completely concur in his analysis, just as he does not com

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pletely concur in mine, but that certainly we respect the faith of our opposite views, and the sincerity of purpose.

I note that in the closing paragraph you specified the whole basis for these hearings. I concur completely with your statement:

Mr. Chairman, there will never be a better time than the present to completely overhaul the ancient and outworn machinery now provided for in the election of the President and Vice President. This is and should be a bipartisan effort.

To that I say Amen. We can only be successful if we approach it in this manner. I also heartily concur in the assessment you make of the dangers involved in the present system in which the electors have the opportunity to affect the system as they now have, through independent judgment.

I must say that although I am sure I do not argue the same points as my friend from Florida, I agree with your analysis of the President's statement. I agree with part of it and I disagree with part of it. I would like to suggest that perhaps the record may need modification since my friend from Florida may not want to confine his disagreement to the President's runoff provision. We should also look at the very initial statement in which the President said:

I have not abandoned my personnal feelings stated in October and November of 1968 that the candidate who wins the most popular votes should become President.

Senator HOLLAND. I saw that with interest, and that showed that the President's interest in practical politics has not changed. Whether the Nation would be sounder constitutionally, he does not go into, and there are many people who believe in practical politics that tend to support the popular election system, and I must say that there is a great temptation presented to the Senator from Florida to do that, because his State, as is true of the State so ably represented by the Senator from Indiana, would gain weight. We are among the relatively small number of States that would gain weight. Indiana would gain 8.5 percent based on the 1960 census, and Florida 7.7.

Of course Florida's gain would be a great deal greater based upon its present population and based upon the population of the next census, but the Senator from Florida believes so strongly in the retention of the counting of the weight of the State as a State the counting of its statehood as something that should be always represented in the selection of President and Vice President, that he is not overtempted by the fact just stated, and he feels that the proportional method is much the sounder, as it will allow every voter in his State and in the State of Indiana and in every other State to have his vote counted in the final countoff.

Senator BAYH. Of course I do not propose this system because I feel my State would gain, nor yours. Frankly I think if you look at the practical aspect of the thing, it would probably lose a little bit because of the influence we now have under the unit rule system. This has been argued both ways. There is plenty of room for disagreement as to whether the large States or the small States now have a practical advantage with the unit rule.

I have heard it argued that the proportionate system-as I recall the President himself presented the argument as one of the reasons for