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the expiration of the third year, so that one third may be chosen every year ; and if vacancies happen by resignation or otherwise, they shall be supplied by the wards in which they happen, in the manner above mentioned. And that no such elector shall be eligible to any office within their gift, during the time for which he shall be elected.
MR. Radcliff had hoped that some gentleman would provide a substitute for this clause; but as it had not been done, he must move to have it stricken out, that some other appointing power could be provided for the city of NewYork. If the committee would take it into consideration, they would find that the city of New-York had many officers not required in the other parts of the state, which rendered it more difficult to settle the appointing power in that city than in any other part of the state. The city and county of New York were co-extensive-- there were no county regulations distinct from those of the city-which was different from the other cities and counties in the state. This rendered it necessary that they should have a different regulation from those places which have both city and county regulations in common. The plan proposed by the gentleman from Orange, for the appointment of justices of the peace, and adopted by the committee, would not answer for the city of NewYork: the court of common pleas, in the city of New York, was composed of the aldermen of the city and first judge-they all belonged to the corporation except the first judge ; therefore, for the court to make a nomination, distinct from the nomination of the supervisors, would be absurd. The plan adopted for other places than the city of New-York, does not at all apply to the case of that city-it would, in fact, amount to this, that the common council should make the appointments; and therefore I am of the opinion that it would be the simplest and best way, to give to the council the appointment of such officers as are in the counties appointed by the supervisors and judges of common pleas. As the sheriff, clerks, and mayor are provided for, we have but one class of officers corresponding with the officers of counties; and that is the justices of the peace. Mr. R. went into a minute description of the different orders of justices in the city of New York, and their respective duties. He concluded by expressing an opinion that the common council would be as proper a body to exercise this power, in appointing justices of the peace, as any other body of men; and he should not object to the first judge associating with them, although it would probably be as well to omit him. With respect to all other ofiicers of that city, not otherwise expressly provided for, he should be willing to leave it to the discretion of the legislature to determine ; and with that view he would offer his amendment, as follows:
“ That the justices of the peace in the city and county of New York, including the official justices, the justices of the marine court and the district justice, and the clerks of the said justices, respectively, be appointed by the common council of said city; and all other officers in said city whose election or appointment is not provided for by this constitution, shall be chosen, or appointed within the said city, in such manner as the legislature may from time to time direct.”
MR. Van Buren could not discover why the common council which had been thought a proper body for the appointment of the other officers, was not also adequate to other trusts. He therefore submitted the following proposition :
“ That all the city or state officers in the city of New-York whose appointments are not otherwise provided for in this constitution, shall be appointed by the common council of the said city and county and shail hold their respective offices dų. ring the pleasure of the said council.”
MR. MUNRO moved that it be laid on the table.
MR. Radcliff supported this motion. The corporation had a vast patronage; and it was very questionable whether it ought to be extended. He hoped that the proposition of the gentleman from Otsego would lie on the table.
Cou. Young would give to New-York the same mode of appointment, and a like tenure of office, as bad been given to the country. . He would go so far as
to expunge the sixth section. He thought the common council equally capable of making appointments, as the supervisors. He was willing, in the event of a tie, to let the first judge decide.
MR. FAIRLIE wished it might be postponed till to-morrow. MR. Munro hoped we should not dispose of offices to the amount of half a million in haste.
MR. VAN BUREN concurred with the gentleman from Westchester (Mr. Munro) in believing that this subject required deliberation.
MR. TOMPKINS hoped we should postpone and reflect on this subject. From his past and present connexion with that city, he knew the importance of the question.
THE CHIEF JUSTICE thought we should pause before we gave such an enormous power to the municipal authorities of that city.
MR. RADCLIFF thought we might at least take the question on striking out the clause.
MR. Jay was in favour of the postponement. The common council, he said, was the legislature of that city. They had the power of taking private property for public use, and of assessing others to pay for it. They had power to make contracts—a power which they had pretty liberally exercised -rery decessary though very despotic powers in relation to the preservation of health and about four hundred offices were already at the disposal of that body. If state patronage would poison the senate, as gentlemen had sapposed, he would submit it whether there was not equal reason to fear that city patronage might poison the common council.
JUDGE Platt begged leave to make one suggestion before the question was taken. He had voted against making the mayor appointable by the corporation, and being in the minority he could not move for a reconsideration. He wished some gentleman in the majority would move a reconsideration of that vote. The subject was postponed till to-morrow.
The seventh section being under consideration, was read in the following words:
$7. That all the officers which are at present elected by the people, continue to be so elected; and all other officers, whose appointment is not provided for by this constitution, and who are not included in the resolution relative to the city of New-York; and all officers who may be hereafter created by law, may be elected by the people, or appointed as the legislature may from time to time by law direct, and in such manner as they shall direct.
Ger. TALLMADGE proposed to amend the section so as to prohibit the legislature from referring any part of the appointments submitted to their disposal to the general appointing power.
MR. VAN BUREN was opposed to it, and wished to know the reasons that could be alleged in its favour.
Gen. TALLMADGE went into an explanation of his views in offering the amendment. He disapproved of the most that had been done on this subject. No part should be left to the legislature.
MR. VAN BUREN said if the gentleman from Dutchess found we were going wrong, he should have put us in the right way. He was not anxious that the appointments should be left to the legislature; but if we interfered with the discretion of that body, we ought to make some other specific disposal of them.
MR. BIRDSEYE said a few words, when
MR. R. CLARKE moved that the seventh section, and the amendment thereto, be postponed till to-morrow. Carried.
TENURE OF OFFICE.
§ 1. The Treasurer to be chosen annually.
$. 2. Secretary of state, comptroller, surveyor, and commissary general, to hold during the pleasure of the legislature-removable by concurrent resolution.
$ 3. Sheriffs to be appointed annually, ineligible after four years, and to hold no other office at the same time.
ý 4. Judges of the courts of common pleas (except the first judge) and surrogates to be appointed for five years, removable by the senate on the recommendation of the governor, stating the grounds on which such removal is recommended.
$ 5. Attorney general to hold his office during the pleasure of the governor and senate, removable by the latter on the recommendation of the former.
$ 6. Recorders of cities by the same tenure, except that the recommendation of removal shall state the grounds.
$7. Mayors of cities to be appointed annually.
$ 8. Clerks of courts and district attorneys to hold during the pleasure of the courts appointing them.
First section read. Carried.
MR. Briggs. Should we be wiser to-morrow than we were to-day? If so, postpone our business till tomorrow.
MR. I. SUTHERLAND was in favour of postponement. It would be better taken in connexion with the judicial report.
The question for postponement was lost.
It was then again moved to strike out the words “ except the first judge." Carried.
MR. MUNRO moved to strike out “ surrogates."
MR. VAN BUREN moved to insert “ secretary of state and," before attorney general, their, for his-offices, for office. Carried.
GEN. TALLMADGE moved to strike out the words “during the pleasure of," and to insert “ for years, unless sooner removed by." Carried.
It was then moved to fill the blank with three ; and carried.
Gen. TALLMADGE moved to strike out“ pleasure of,” and insert “ for years, unless sooner removed by.” Carried.
Moved to fill the blank with three. Carried.
MR. Van Buren offered the following resolution : “ That the secretary of state and attorney general hold their respective offices for three years from the time of their appointment, unless sooner removed by the senate on the recommendation of the governor.” Carried.
JUDGE VAN Ness moved to reconsider the sixth section. Agreed to.
He further moved to reconsider the fourth section, for the purpose of inserting“ recorders of cities,” after the words “courts of common pleas.” Agreed to, and the insertion made accordingly.
GEN. TALLMADE proposed to reconsider the second section. Agreed to.
He then moved to strike out the words “during the pleasure of,” and insert " for
years, unless sooner removed by.” Carried. He proposed to fill the blank with three years. Carried.
The question was then on filling the blank in Mr. Duer's amendment respecting justices of the peace.
It was proposed to fill the blank with three years.
MR. MUNRO thought it would be better to leave the time of meeting indefnite. It was not necessary to turn out and appoint at stated times, but merely to fill up vacancies.
THE CHIEF JUSTICE thought it would be well for the meeting for general purposes to be once in three years-to fill vacancies, as often as necessary.
MR. VAN BUREN moved to postpone the further consideration of the clause till to-morrow.
MR. SAELDON proposed to amend in such manner, that the judges of the courts of common pleas should be elected by the people.
The question was taken by ayes and noes, and decided in the negative as follows:
AYES—Messrs, Baker, Brinkerhoff, Brooks, Hurd, N. Sanford, Sharpe, Sheldon, E. Webster, Young---9.
NOES—Messrs. Bacon, Barlow, Beckwith, Birdseye, Breese, Briggs, Buel, Burroughs, Carpenter, Carver, Child, D. Clark, Clyde, Collins, Cramer, Day, Dubois, Duer, Dyckman, Eastwood, Edwards, Fairlie, Fenton, Ferris, Frost, Hallock, Hees, Hogeboom, Howe, Humphrey, Hunt, Hunter, Honting, Huntington, Jay, Jones, Kent, King, Lansing, Lefferts, Livingston, M'Call, Millikin, Moore, Munro, Nelson, Park, Paulding, Platt, Porter, President, Price, Pumpelly, Radcliff, Reeve, Rhinelander, Richards, Rockwell, Root, Rosebrugh, Ross, Russell, Sage, Sanders, R. Sandford, Schenck, Seeley, I Smith, R. Smith, Spencer, Stagg, Starkweather, Steel, D. Southerland, I. Sutherland, Swift, Sylvester, Tallmadge, Taylor, Ten Eyck, Townsend, Tripp, Tuttle, Van Buren, Van Horne, Van Ness, J. R. Van Rensselaer, Van Vechten, Ward, A. Webster, Wendover, Wheaton, E. Williams, N. Williams, Woods, Wooster, Yates--97.
MR. TOMPKINS then renewed the motion of Mr. Van Buren, that it be postponed till to-morrow.
MR. Van Buren proposed to reconsider the 8th section on military appointments. Agreed to.
He then moved to strike out the word “militia" before officers, that the appointinent of civil, as well as militia officers, might be by the governor, during the recess of the senate.
MR. E. WILLIAMS opposed, and it was lost.
Gen. Root said the question before the Convention would be on the whole clause--which he moved to have stricken out. Carried.
CHANCELLOR Kent proposed to reconsider the 4th section on civil appointments. Agreed to.
The committee then rose, reported progress, and obtained leave to sit again. in Convention, on motion of Mr. Radcliff, ordered, that the report, as amended, be printed. Carried.
MR. Yates moved that the committee of the whole be discharged from the further consideration of the report on the appointing power, and that it be referred to a select committee, and offered a resolution to that effect.
The motion was opposed by Messrs. Van Buren and Van Vechten, and lost. JUDGE VAN Ness offered the following amendment.
And the supervisors and judges of the court of common pleas, (except in the city and county of New-York,) shall in like manner appoint the several officers following, to wit:-auctioneers, coroners, inspectors of turnpike roads, and inspectors of beef and pork, &c.
Which said officers may be removed, and vacancies from time to time filled, in like manner, as is provided in relation to justices of the peace.
GEN. TALLMADGE moved that the report of the committee on the legislatire department, be made the order of the day to-morrow-Carried.
MR. FAIRLIE offered the following resolution.
Resolved, That the 19th article of the constitution of this state, ought to be abolished
Resolved, That it be referred to a committee to consider and report to the Con. vention, what provision be proper to be adopted in relation to the appointment of senators of ihe United States.
Referred to the committee, of which Mr. Radcliff is chairman.
MR. N. Williams offered the following resolution : “ that the secretary of state be required to lay before the Convention, a list of the civil officers in the city of New York."
Ön motion of Mr. Root, Adjourned.
THURSDAY, OCTOBER 11, 1821. The President took his seat at the usual hour, and no chaplain being present, the minutes of yesterday were read and approved.
The following communication was received from the secretary of state, pursuant to the resolution of yesterday :
STATE OF NEW-YORK,
Secretary's Office, Albany, October 11, 1821. Sir-In obedience to a resolution of the honourable the Convention of this state, of yesterday, requesting me “ to lay before them a list of the civil officers in the city of New-York,” I have the honour of submitting to them, through you, the enclosed list of the civil officers, holding their commissions in that city, under the council of appointment.-Some of the officers in that list may have ceased to act, or are disqualified from acting ; but there is nothing in the possession of this de. partment, enabling me to ascertain their number. I have the bonour to be, very respectfully, your obed't.
J. v. N. YATES, Secretary of State. The Hon. DANIEL D. TOMPKINS President of the Convention. $
} A list of the civil officers in the city of New-York, under the council of appoint
ment. No. of Officers.
Cullers of staves and heading, 18 First judge, 1 Assistant state sealer,
1 Mayor, 1 Inspector of four,
1 Recorder, 1 Do. beef and pork,
3 District attorney,
Do. fish oil,
Do. pot and pearl ashes,
17 Register, 1
1 Clerk of the city and county, 1 Do. leather,
2 Clerk of the oyer and terminer and Do. distilled spirits,
1 Inspectors of the stale prison at Clerk of the sittings, and circuit court,1 New-York,
7 Special (or police) justices, 3 Commissioners of excise,
1 Police clerk,
1 Directors of the bank of America, Justices of the marine court 3 Do. do. New-York,
2 Assistant justices,
Do. do. Mechanics,
1 Aactioneers, 36 Do. do. Phænix,
1 Resident physician,
1 Do. do. Franklin, Commission of the health office, 1 Examiners in chancery,
5 Health officer, 1 Masters in chancery,
71 Harbour masters,
2 Commissioners to acknowledge Master and wardens of the port, 6 deeds, &c.
114 Branch pilots by way of Sandy Hook, 28 Public notaries,
543 Inspector general of staves and head. ing